OOPS?
I'd been expecting my Kenmore dishwasher, purchased in 1999, to fail any year since about 2006.
By that time, if not nearly since the beginning, it routinely made a loud grinding and squealing sound during draining especially but also mostly during regular operation. You wouldn't want to talk over it. I'm sure it wasn't as bad as an actual sawmill, but it did bring that to mind.
I was giving it up for goners by 2006 but then a friend told me about Lemi-Shine Machine cleaner. I used it infrequently but enough to keep the machine going for 25 years until I had a major leak across the kitchen floor. I figured the grinding had finally cut through the pump housing, or the plastic tub had cracked. It would certainly not be worth fixing.
But just after my replacement machine was installed in November 2024, I noticed a tiny cut out part was left behind, which seemed to be a portion of the drain hose which had ruptured right next to the machine (inside the cabinet made for the dishwasher, so I couldn't see the problem).
So it's now looking like I didn't need to replace my Kenmore dishwasher at all. If I had only thought about the possibility that it could be just a busted drain hose!
I had looked at the hose under the sink...but it probably busted right next to the machine where I couldn't see it.
But what if I had thought of that possibility (I should have just asked google what could cause a dishwasher leak) what could I have done? It might have been hard to get appliance repair to even look at it. Sears isn't around anymore, so I couldn't call Sears. Independent repair people would say it's too old to get replacement parts, etc. If I had gotten an appliance repair guy out here, it might have taken weeks for them to get around to it (appliance repair still hadn't come out in 3 weeks for my 13 year old Whirlpool washing machine before I finally decided to buy a new LG machine) they have a minimum charge for coming out and for doing an estimate. You'd be lucky if that initial charge were only $200, I think it's usually more like $300. The cost of the repair would probably be $250, for which they'd knock off $150 of the original $300 charge, leaving you with a $400 bill for replacing the hose.
If you knew that a busted hose was the issue, you could do it yourself, or just call a plumber who might fix it for around $250. But normally a plumber would tell you they don't know anything about dishwashers. And it might cost as much as $400 too.
So I don't know. If I had known it was just the hose, I probably would have replaced the hose if I could get that done for $250. But the dishwasher was long due for replacement anyway. Besides the incredible noise it made, it didn't work at all with the new wash packs, it didn't clean very well even with liquid Cascade sometimes, and occasionally even left stuff that looked like plastic pieces dried to the glasses (I noticed that on a few pieces just before the leak). I imagined it was falling apart internally. I was wondering how much dishwasher micro plastic I'd consumed over the years. It would be nice to have new dishwasher with stainless steel interior instead and newer parts that aren't deteriorating. It might fail at some inconvenient time, such as over the holidays when I have a party scheduled. I often thought about replacing it just for reasons such as those. So it was probably a good thing to have it not just "fixed" with a new hose but completely replaced, using the $250-$400 repair cost going towards a long overdue new unit.
Deciding, or Lusting?
To be prepared for the decision I knew I'd soon need to make, I started looking at dishwashers in the Sears store at Ingram Park Mall around 2006. Or perhaps it was as early as 2003. I many many minutes looking at the dishwashers at that Sears store until it closed in 2017. It was a convenient detour on my lunchtime stroll from the parking lot to the Luby's Cafeteria next door to Sears.
I noticed how most dishwashers were converging on the very minimalist stainless steel look of the Bosch dishwashers, though Bosch is still among the most minimalist of them all in appearance (in the general lack of any control or displays visible on front).
And I often read and sometimes even clipped the Consumer Reports columns on dishwashers, at least to be prepared for the moment, any day now, when I might need to buy a new one. I saw the Bosch dishwashers were, year after year, either at or adjacent to the top in Consumer Reports.
(Nowadays I am very frustrated that the Consumer Reports magazine only has limited content, most often in a kind of "top 5 summary", with the detailed reporting and complete lists only being online. And since my email address has changed, I haven't been able to access my online account in decades. Now it's associated t's associated my latest email with a freebee account, so I get none of the benefits of my 40 year full subscription, and I can't seem to change it to anything else. Fortunately for me, and this seems to have been the case before, I was able to get a full listing of all Consumer Reports tested models, with summary ratings in each category, from Bosch themselves on their website.)
But other than taking a quick scan sometimes of the Consumer Reports summary info when an issue listed Dishwashers on the cover, I hadn't really been keeping up with dishwashers that much recently. It's always been on the short list of things that might need replacement at any time.
But as I figured I'd probably do anyway, on the day after the dishwasher broke, I looked at all the information I could find, in the past copies of Consumer Reports, and elsewhere. Finally I tracked down the complete list of Consumer Reports recommendations at the Bosch site, which was the most useful bit of information of all.
And Bosch are all the top winners, for their various Benchmark, 500, and 800 series machines for starters.
Now this is misleading as Consumer Reports often is. The Benchmark model is shown with identical scores in all the major categories to the 800. And the 500 series which is shown before the 800 series has a lower drying score, but Consumer Reports lets that fly because it's slightly cheaper and puts the 500 series ahead of the 800 series but the Benchmark highest of all, even though the Benchmark is basically a glorified 800.
If you want the top performance in all major categories, you want either the Benchmark or the 800 series, which both have Crystal Dry, the latest in Bosch drying innovations (which they've needed, since other goals like energy efficiency have reduced drying performance).
The main thing extra that the Benchmark has is the water softener, so if you don't need that, there's not much to justify the significantly higher price (though I've come to miss the readout time on the floor feature...it's a crying shame Bosch does not show remaining time otherwise, even the numbers on top turn off after awhile).
I'm leery of using a water softener because basically what it's doing is adding salt, which is not good for either people or metals. (Some may have to, and it's probably ok.)
It turned out there was a "front controls" model, temporarily imported from Europe, of the 800 series but WITH the "water softener." Getting those would be additional wait time, higher price, and Lowe's didn't even list them I'd need to go to Best Buy. Lowe's had their own "exclusive model" but it seemed so different it could have been an earlier model, and I think it didn't have the front controls either.
If I had really wanted the water softener, I'd have gotten the Benchmark with time on the floor and everything. But I felt I could live without all of that.
Delivery and Installation
When I was checking out the various Bosch 800 models available at Lowe's on Wednesday afternoon, the Lowe's website predicted Monday delivery of the model I had decided on, having the "pocket" handle (which has a flush face) rather than the model with a handle bar that sticks out, because the bar model was more expensive, and I worried about the bar coming down and decapitating a cat...but it turns out the Bosch doors do not "fall" down like the Kenmore door did, they need to be gently pushed down, and the Bosch door is so much lower than the Kenmore door that no cat could be even under the flat door, though being hit by the handle would still be worse...it nearly touches the floor). The bar model also means you are more separated from the countertop above, which is where I do many cooking things including cutting and oiling. The flush front is ideal for using the countertop above, and it's nicer to be working above or just looking at the flat stainless front of the Bosch than my old bulgy gaudy beige Kenmore.
Lowe's had an 'exclusive' Bosch 800 model which was cheapest of all, but it didn't seem to have the latest options (perhaps I didn't check everything carefully enough to be sure it wasn't the European model that had the "water softener", from the comparison chart it actually looked like it lacked the "water filter" that the regular Bosch pocket and bar models had, and there didn't seem to be a row for "water softener" because none of the models had it, and the exclusive model also did not have the front controls that the European model had...I'm completely fine with the top controls, maybe I even like them better because you don't have to stoop to see which options you are enabling, but I only wish they kept the time remaining visible).
I could have ordered Wednesday night, but there was a special offer that said you could get a full rebate of "basic" installation (that would not include the fee for disposal of the old unit, I presume) but only if you ordered the installation at a Lowe's store. (Ordering installation at the store might be required anyway, but it certainly was required for this special offer.) So I decided I would go down to Lowe's first thing after breakfast on Thursday morning and order the specific model I had decided on.
I started looking at some display models and the salesman came up. I forgot to bring the card on which I had written down the exact model number I wanted. No problem, he said, I'll just look it up for you. He started flipping through the models on his tablet. He usually seemed to focus on the Lowe's exclusive 800 model which was the cheapest of all. I told him I had not seen the correct model, which I was pretty sure was selling for $1167. He said it would be better on his main terminal. So we went there, and once again he flipped through the models, and they didn't seem to match. Except I noticed that as he was flipping through the 800 models, he started flipping immediately after it came up with the first page, which was only visible for a few seconds. I asked him to let me try and flipped right to it, as I thought, it was the first one listed when you searched for Bosch 800 Dishwasher.
Whereas Lowe's Online had said they had over 100 units in stock, the salesman said they had 68 in stock. (But that must be at some warehouse!) But it would take until Wednesday for pickup at the store.
The salesman asked if I'd like to use my plumber. Actually, I had not even though of that, but I told him I wanted the Lowe's Installation. He told me I could possibly get it installed as soon as Friday next week, because Lowe's installers don't get paid until the work is done and so they are anxious to complete it. (Lowe's doing fast installation is contrary to other stories I have heard, where people have had delays and issues going on for months. But I hoped he was right and made the sale.)
He told me I should call some number on Monday to confirm I was on the list. I thought he circled the number on the receipt, but when I checked the receipt on Wednesday the following week (because I had been to busy to call Lowe's until then, and I knew it wasn't getting done until Friday anyway) there was no circled number, in fact I didn't see a number at all, just the store number. So I called that and they told me to call the Lowe's Installation number (or perhaps I just figured that out myself from the website).
The Lowe's Installation number sounded like it was a national number not local, and the information was very disturbing. For one thing the dishwasher had not yet arrived in store and would only be "available" on Thursday. After it arrived, then I would get a call and arrange for installation. I asked when I should get that call and they said by Friday. Well, in that case, it didn't sound like I was going to be getting Friday installation. I asked and they said probably not.
I was pretty downtrodden. But it didn't last long. It was just after 1pm on Thursday afternoon that I got a call from the actual installation contractor. They left both a phone message AND a text. Not expecting a phone call until Friday, I wasn't even looking at my phone, and didn't even notice I had both phone and text messages until around 4:45. Now it looked like Friday had been possible after all, but I probably missed my Friday slot by not being on the ball, again. Now it might have to wait until after Thanksgiving. Damned!
In a state of panic, I ended up leaving the phone message first, and getting confused about the time (saying 1-3PM when actually they had said 12-3, which was better actually but at the time I was leaving the message I couldn't remember exactly what had been said I was so nervous about losing my slot). Then I left a responsive text too, and simply saying "afternooon." (I should have checked what they said first so no ambiguity.)
In about 15 minutes my text was answered, and I was given the afternoon slot, just as I had asked. I was jubilant.
The installer actually arrived at 1:30, and took a look at the situation and determined I needed to have a new supply valve because the old one was broken. I should have a plumber fix that then call him back.
So I immediately called my usual plumber, Primo Plumbing, and they first promised Monday but then called me back 15 minutes later with an available slot at 4pm, which I accepted. So before 5pm, my plumbing was fixed and I then left a message at the contractor office and then after that I called the actual installer, who answered and said he'd make sure they got the message.
By 11am Saturday morning I got a text from the contractor saying that Monday would be available. I did not notice that text until 11pm and then texted back that anytime Monday was fine and Tuesday afternoon also. Once again I was worried I'd lost my first available slot. So I was uneasy. But by Sunday morning I got the reply that Monday was possible and they'd let me know the time later. By 4pm on Sunday afternoon my appointment for 11-2pm was offered and confirmed.
The installer arrived around noon and was finished by 1:15, including the 15-minute "test clean."
Now that the plumbing was fixed, it was a piece of cake. The plumber had replaced the dual valve with a single valve and T connection. That's probably the usual thing nowadays and the installer said nothing about it.
The dishwasher was installed about as quickly as it could possibly have been installed! It was almost a miracle I got my usual plumber to come out 90 minutes after the Lowe's installer determined a new cutoff valve was needed and so I got it done that very day. Then it was another miracle I got the dishwasher installed on the very next business day.
I told the installer I had been worried this would take months.
I only noticed later that while I was doing all this messaging with the actual installer, a contractor, I was also getting calls and texts from Lowe's Installation, which I had (perhaps fortuitously) ignored.
Despite the installer saying it wasn't necessary, I ran a full empty cycle with the Normal cycle and Sanitary in the owners manual (which I dug up online, because strangely it wasn't included with the actual dishwasher--only the multi-language installation manual).
I should have chosen the Heavy Duty cycle with Sanitary option but the manual only said "with the highest water temperature and doesn't specify the Heavy Duty cycle as such, which made it confusing, I figured Sanitary would be the highest regardless but Heavy Duty Sanitary is just a bit higher.
This machine is so quiet, I wondered at first if it was even running. The refrigerator makes far more noise. Even the water filling is nearly silent. I didn't expect that at all. This is not just different and better than before, it's way better, it's like a miracle.
I ran my dishes which had in many cases been waiting for a wash for days on the Heavy Duty cycle, and I have never seen dishes come out so clean with my old dishwasher.
So perhaps I could have avoided it, but a new era has dawned, probably long overdue.
A Way Better Dishwasher
The Bosch Dishwasher is fantastic in many ways. It's actually quiet (unlike all previous dishwashers I've had which were as noisy as hell). It seems completely sealed so that no moisture or smells are emitted during washing or otherwise. That means I can run it while I'm in the kitchen doing other things and not be bothered by Dishwasher Fog as with the old Kenmore, despite the Kenmore claiming automatic sealing as a feature right on the front panel. It's like the Kenmore was only "virtually" sealed, whereas the Bosch is actually sealed. I'm sure this helps make the Bosch quieter too.
The Kenmore had an active vent system that supposedly closed during operation but never did close very well. The kitchen would always get more humid when the dishwasher was running, and I'd worry about all the chemicals in the detergent getting into the air too so I'd open the outdoor vent (my motorized kitchen vent) or run it late at night.
It seems to get the dishes cleaner, and possibly even dryer than the Kenmore did. (I always used the Kenmore on no-heat drying, the Bosch never uses electric heat in drying, just the optional patented CrystalDry if you select it, which I do.)
It looks very very nice in all stainless steel (which is lacquer coated so dirt just wipes off...and use of an abrasive stainless steel cleaner would ruin it).
I was worried that the racks would work as well as the Kenmore did for my quirky set of dishes, but I was wrong, the racks work just fine, maybe even better.
Downsides. As might be expected, the basic German Engineering is wonderful but the user interface features are crap. (I feel similar dissatisfaction with the user interface of asian products. US manufacturers don't have perfect interfaces either, but often they are better. My Whirlpool washer had very intuitive controls, and I replaced it with an LG which is at least as good, will hopefully last longer, but has overcomplicated and unintuitive controls, which I recall is typical with Samsung as well.)
1) There is no built-in time delay feature. With the Kenmore I simply pressed the "delay" button once for each hour of delay I wanted, and it showed up on the time indicator. I'd think any dishwasher above the base metal level should have this feature.
But with the Bosch, to use a time delay or scheduled start you must use the Bosch smart device app known as Home Connect. This is much more complicated and inconvenient.
You have to go through all the usual crapola to install the app on your phone. Then the app will decide your dishwasher needs a firmware update, and you need to wait for that too. Then finally you have to agree to let the app Start your dishwasher by enabling the permanent remote start mode. The app advises you that there may be risks, but you need to do this for the optimum experience. Basically that means doing time delay starts and time starts. You must either give the app permission each time or enabling permanent remote start. I wouldn't have wanted to give the app this permission, but I ultimately had to.
I tried to use the app time delay without enabling permanent remote start and nothing happened. I got no notifications, no button appeared telling me I needed to enable remote start. It simply didn't start.
I'm not giving Bosch any extra credit for having an app. Sure it enables controlling the a few complicated features that would be more difficult to control on the device itself. But dealing with an app makes everything more complicated. I'd be much happier if Bosch simply made the regular controls easier to use.
And all Bosch would have had to do is add one more button for the same kind of time delay convenience I used to have with my Kenmore. And then I might never need or use the app at all. The default settings (which can also be controlled on the dishwasher itself) are fine.
It looks like at one time they did have such a button, but on the most current generations of Bosch dishwashers the time delay button has become the Home Control App button. The Home Control App button could have been some kind of menu item instead. Or just have another button, but that might have required an expensive redesign like the one Boeing failed to do for it's Max planes, but probably not quite that expensive.
2. There is no built-in indication of the time remaining before the wash is complete. Almost all dishwashers have this, but it would deviate from the austere minimalism of the Bosch exterior design. Now in many ways, I like the Bosch exterior design. But I'd like it better if instead of giving me a little light telling me the dishes are being washed, it gave me a readout of the estimated time remaining.
Now Bosch does have a digital time readout, but it's on the top edge of the door where it's normally hidden by the countertop when the door is closed. I could still read it anyway because the gap between the dishwasher door and the countertop is just wide enough for me to see it at a steep angle but still readable. But that digital time readout simply stops when the dishwasher is running, so even though I could have read it, I can't. And there is no option to keep that display going when the dishwasher is running.
Instead, you can read the estimated time remaining in the app. Once again, that's a lot more inconvenient that just reading it on the dishwasher itself. Also in the Home Page of the app, the display time doesn't show continuously, it flashes very sporadically like 1 second every 30 seconds. You have to press on the big blue option block to get to the page where it shows the percentage completed, finish time, and time remaining (that's nice, but just time remaining would have been sufficient).
Now, it the much more expensive Benchmark model you do get a time remaining indication from the actual dishwasher. But even that is not on the dishwasher itself. It's projected onto the floor and called TimeLight.
The back story here is ridiculous. Since the dawn of electrical devices, they have had lights that indicate when they are running.
But, incredibly, Bosch was so into their minimalist aesthetic that they did not bother with such things. Instead, for the pricier models, they invented InfoLight which projects a dot of red light onto the floor when the dishwasher is running. Integral to InfoLight is that you can turn it off with a setting option, if you didn't happen to want a dot of light projected on the floor (I'd rather not call any more attention to my worn out floor personally).
I thought I'd rather have a light on the unit itself, and it turns out that the particular 800 model that I purchased, the InfoLight is actually just a light on the door. Even within the 800 series, there are some models that project InfoLight on the floor and some that just have it as a light on the door. But it is still called InfoLight and you can turn it on or off with the same setting used for other Bosch models.
Ok, I'm fine with a light on the door telling me that the dishwasher is running. I don't even have a compelling reason to turn it off. I find it very amusing that a "light on the door" has a trademarked name. I love to enunciate InfoLight in a deep radio announcer voice. What a concept!
But on the pricier Benchmark models, InfoLight is replaced by TimeLight where it projects the remaining time, in digital clock format, onto the floor. (I don't think there is a Benchmark model where they have the TimeLight on the door, where it would be just like the remaining time indicator on my old Kenmore and probably most dishwashers.)
You can call it whatever you want, but a small digital readout of the elapsed time on the door would be nice. Or just don't turn off the indicator that is on the top edge of the door.
And I have one other complaint, though I think it's part of the deal of having a better dishwasher:
3. The dishes get as dry as they did with the Kenmore. But the inside of the dishwasher has condensed water on the sidewalls. I think this is because water condenses more easily on stainless steel than on the plastic liner of my old Kenmore. And it is much better sealed. Also because of the better sealing, if you keep dirty dishes inside the Bosch for very long, it begins to stink when you open the door, more than the Kenmore did.
One More Thing
In every way, my installer seemed competent and professional. I'm not going to fault him for what I am about to describe at all.
But I don't think an electrician would be very fond of the way the dishwasher is wired into my electrical system. It uses, I think as installed by the original home builder in 1982, a "floating electrical box." An electrician would tell me that it's against electrical code, even though builders built a lot of homes that way. The wires come out from under the wall and go into a sealed electric box resting on the floor. Current electrical code requires all electrical boxes to be "permanently attached to the structure." Well, actually, by this time the "floating box" is essentially permanently attached to the structure, via debris left by generations of carpenter ants. I bet you'd have to pry it off the floor.
I was wondering about this floating electrical box and asked the installer. He said that he found such a "floating box" about 70% of the time, and it was perfectly fine and legal for him to plug the dishwasher into it. He said I could return the interconnection box that Bosch had provided in the event there was no plug for him to plug into, but only a bare wire from the wall. Since I already had "a box" I didn't need it, I could use my Bosch Dishwasher with the attached electrical cord plugged into the outlet that was already there, atop the floating box.
This setup is still a concern, which I now feel is best addressed by changing the dishwasher breaker to a GFCI. That is not currently the case in my house. It is also currently required by electrical code.
If I live to see this dishwasher replaced, I will consider putting in an actual wall outlet behind it.